I get that we are moving out during the next week, but the brew house has degenerated into a shit hole over the past month. People are still using the space for brewing and bottling. When I came in today to bottle, the sink was full of dirty glasses, the sink counter and tables are caked with wort and hops, and there was a puddle of something on the ferm room floor by its entrance. This is completely unacceptable. And the brew house has been in this condition the past four times I've been there. Please clean up after yourselves. Remember, we are bringing all of this stuff with us, fly covered tables and garbage cans included. I scrubbed the sink counter top, but, not being anyone in the club's mother, I did not clean anything else.
Also, if you break something, please let the board know so it can be replaced. Someone broke the santizer thing used for bottling. I found half of it in the garbage, which, of course was full by the way, and the other half in the sink. I was able to fix the damaged part, so it works for now, but we'll need to get a new one once we'er settled in to the new brew house.
Please get into the habit of being responsible before we start using the new brew house. Thanks.
Well said Jeff. Thank you.
Someone keeps leaving dirty glasses and equipment in the sink... Herb was kind enough to wash a bunch of stuff last week when I was there. As Jeff said, unacceptable.
I was in there yesterday to bottle and the two red "wing" cappers we had are gone; glasses in the sink; the mop bucket is moldy; even broken glass on the floor...blah, blah, blah.
Board, please take steps to address these issues in our new brewhouse. Personally, the brewhouse has become less and less appealing to the point that, while I'm happy to continue on as treasurer, I am very likely to cancel my membership and just start brewing at home again (at least there I can find stuff and I know it won't be broken/dirty!).
I don't really know why people have stopped caring about the condition of the brewhouse. It's ridiculous that things have degenerated to the point that they are now, and with the impending move, it's apparent that folks think it's not worth their time to clean things up.
Whatever the reason for the deterioration, we will certainly not tolerate anything similar happening at the new brewhouse.
Are people just coming in there to hang out and drink? It seems like the main complaint is the sink full of dirty glasses...which we might want to consider doing a peg board for mugs that can hang upside down while the dry on one of the walls. The glass situation never really worked well while they were drying and I was witness to the wood rack getting bumped and a whole rack of glass getting shattered.
Secondly, I agree wholeheartedly about the downward spiral that the brewhouse has taken...especially for the hardline position the board took on keeping the old brewhouse function while the new brewhouse was getting built out.
We'll have to see how things go in the new place, but I am all for doing member audits after brew days/nights and initiating a two strikes and you are gone policy.
Or maybe a camera or two?
Oh... my... god. Why haven't we done this? http://thechive.com/2013/09/17/guys-rig-up-buddies-plumbing-with-beer-wh...
I do think we need cameras.
Well it's all moot now, I removed the gas lines this morning and will be taking out the hot water lines dis afternoon. As of now the old brewhouse is no longer functioning...
Awesome, thanks Chuck!
Just for the record I'm against the Big Brother approach at the new brew house for our members. If things start happening outside the building then I am comfortable with them. Thanks Chuck!!!
As far as the glass situation, in the new brewhouse we have that kitchen sink in the lounge area. Perhaps we can put a dish drainer/drying rack next to the sink, where it's away from the giant pots full of boiling liquid and other big, heavy things that can knock glasses over. I definitely think having glassware able to be cleaned/stored in the lounge area will help assist in reducing breakage. Obviously that helps nothing if people are leaving their dirty dishes everywhere, but it's something.
Here is my take: y'all can bitch about how shit is dirty, but has anyone taken it upon themselves to clean?
From whaT I saw today, the answer is NO!
Jim, you where at the brew house bottling, ya talk about leaving the club, but did ya do any dishes? No ya didn't.
Yeah it sucks cleaning after other people, I get it, but myself has taken it upon myself to clean and then find out who was before me and have a personal talk with them...
I am busting my ass right now for the club and if ya wanna leave over some dirt yet do nothing about it but bitch then FUCK OFF!
Personally: The surest way to get me not to do something is to tell me to "fuck off." Furthermore, as if I weren't already on the fence about whether or not to continue to utilise the brewhouse, a board member telling me to "fuck off" might have sealed the deal.
Club-related: This is no one's full-time job nor should anyone be treating as a such (or seemingly holding it over people's heads when they can't). It's not the responsibilty of a select few (read: burnt out board members; and former board members and even the former Alchemists) to clean up the shit other people leave blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's a problem we had since day one in the brew house that were never addressed even under the Alchemists. We've continually discussed how to get fresh blood on the board and involved with the club...blah, blah, blah, blah.
So, you bet yer ass it's the uncleanliness that makes me want to leave; but the uncleanliness is really a manifestation of a more serious problem in the club IMHO.
Jim, I am sorry for going off on you. I shouldn't be on the interweb at 1am being burnt out and some what buzzed...
You are right the state of the brewhouse. It's a disresept to all members when people have left it a mess...
But, what is the solution?
Again Jim I appoligize for being an ass...
Hey, no worries. I sorta figured as much (well, the burnt out part not necessarily the buzzed part).
We do, though, need to answer that question that Lucas posed in another thread (which I may be more than slightly misquoting): do people simply see this as a "I pay my monthly dues and so I'm going to do whatever I please" and/or should be start monitoring, checking, incentivizing stuff?
I think I might have bandied this idea about some time ago but someone mentioned "badges" on our website (cf., Untappd app). Since everyone (ideally) has to sign up for a brew bay to brew or the bottling/kegging station, why not have that pop up on their web-site profile (I can already envision one badge: "most brews"); the next person to sign up for that brew bay or the bottling/kegging station "rates" the previous user of that brew bay/station. Altnernately, if we want some anonymity, just let people rate each other? The higher the rating the more perks they get? The lower the rating...?
This is all just brainstorming. But, the sooner we can try to implement some solutions, the better idea we'd have of what members may be amenable to do to keeping the brewhouse in order/clean.
The fancy new lock Iggy got for us apparently can asign each Brewer level member a access code which can be monitered on a computer... At least if we find the place trashed, we can go online and know for certain who was there last...
If we really want to go all crazy big brother, I can make it so that people have to badge into a brew bay and it turns on for 8 hours or something. We could even put a Yes/No button on it that requires you to say if the bay was clean beforehand.
I would say though, I am not for this idea right now. Too big brother-ish for me.
Oh... my... god. Why haven't we done this? http://thechive.com/2013/09/17/guys-rig-up-buddies-plumbing-with-beer-wh...
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I hate to use the term "police" but it's really a matter of incentivizing me=
mbers "policing" each other rather than top-down "policing"....
Sent from my mobile device.
On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:51, "CHAOS Brew Club" <reply+6425256d79ae7bc3781471a17=
149ba0c@chaosbrewclub.net> wrote:
> lucas commented on the post "Brew House Cleanliness"
> --------------------
> If we really want to go all crazy big brother, I can make it so that peopl=
e have to badge into a brew bay and it turns on for 8 hours or something. W=
e could even put a Yes/No button on it that requires you to say if the bay w=
as clean beforehand. =20
> I would say though, I am not for this idea right now. Too big brother-ish=
for me. =20
>=20
> --------------------
>=20
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<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>I hate to use the term "police" but it's really a matter of incentivizing members "policing" each other rather than top-down "policing"....<br><br>Sent from my mobile device.</div><div><br>On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:51, "CHAOS Brew Club" <<a href="mailto:reply+6425256d79ae7bc3781471a17149ba0c@chaosbrewclub.net">reply+6...@chaosbrewclub.net</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
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<p>lucas commented on the post "Brew House Cleanliness"<br>
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If we really want to go all crazy big brother, I can make it so that people have to badge into a brew bay and it turns on for 8 hours or something. We could even put a Yes/No button on it that requires you to say if the bay was clean beforehand. <br>
I would say though, I am not for this idea right now. Too big brother-ish for me. </p>
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I would say, if it's not too difficult to handle the web-side and the hardware side, it would be good for each brewer level member to have his or her own access code. Then the code doesn't need to change each month--if someone cancels, we make their code invalid.
Short term we're going to have one access code for that door lock. Longer term (month or so I'm hoping) I'm buidling an RFID system so that each person will have to badge in.
Oh... my... god. Why haven't we done this? http://thechive.com/2013/09/17/guys-rig-up-buddies-plumbing-with-beer-wh...
We're about to get outside the scope of this thread, but will the new system require new membership cards lucas?
I'll help us stay in scope and forward us over here where I've already talked about this. I'll post something now with some info.
Oh... my... god. Why haven't we done this? http://thechive.com/2013/09/17/guys-rig-up-buddies-plumbing-with-beer-wh...
the larger the brew club becomes (in membership), the larger the anonimity becomes and unfortunately, the messiness issue is just going to get worse. we couldnt handle it with 13 people, you are not going to handle it now or with more either.
start considering a paid cleaning crew fund. or start enforcing the policies.
...igz...
Just personal/anecdotal but, although I'm fed up with doing shit others were supposed to have done, I would be entirely more willing at this point to clean up after others for example if I could either (a) get something; or (b) get a discount on my membership. I had set up an "Alchemist Work/Study" program when it was still the Alchemists and no one took advantage of it (you get $x off your membership for working toward the general upkeep/cleanliness of the brewhouse). But, maybe now (since other ideas brought up during the Alchemist regime are being resurrected by people who weren't even around for the Alchemists - e.g., the mugs on a peg-board idea), this could gain some traction?
I think you may risk sending the message to those not inclined to clean up that, since they pay full price, they will let those that don't clean up after them. Maybe couple the incentives with additional costs for those who don't. Sounds complicated, but otherwise everyone who already cleans up after themselves now gets a discount, and how do the bills get paid?
Of all the ideas, I think Iggy's is the best, if we can't convince people to not be filthy animals because it's the right thing to do. Better to just pay someone to clean up the space than to try to come up with a complicated scheme of discounts and penalties. Once lucas's door lock/card swipe system is in place, we'll at least have an idea of who used the brewhouse when, and we can consider implementing a 2/3/4 strikes and you're out program for egregious messes.
I think there's some other options that we have. I like Jim's idea of some form of compensation for doing work for the club, I also like the idea of a multi-strike policy to keep things clean. To me, I think cleaning up isn't something that is compensation-worthy. That's a minimum for using the space.
I do think we should consider giving people who build something, donate something, being Chuck, etc. should get you a discount on membership, some free swag, or maybe we see if we can get Brew and Grow, Goose Island, Midwest, etc. to give us gift cards that we can give out for doing stuff for the club. But cleaning up... that's probably going to have to be more stick than carrot.
Oh... my... god. Why haven't we done this? http://thechive.com/2013/09/17/guys-rig-up-buddies-plumbing-with-beer-wh...
I think your going to continue to see the old
Brewhouse be a mess but don't think there's any reason to expect the same attitude towards a new place. This is all moot. That being said, the best thing is going to be, like Iggi and Jim say, to pay someone/give them free membership, to clean. It's just smart and makes sense.