I think we are at a point where we can make an announcement and start gathering folks for this. There's a few things up in the air at this point, it has been decided that we will be doing a Coffee School. We are currently in the process of trying to connect with one of the local roasters to secure our coffee and partner with. Right now there are things we know and things we don't just yet:
1. Kyle will be taking lead on this one. He and I will be working together on it along with all participating brewers. It's just too big to do it correctly by myself these days.
2. There are many ways to approach this, we think the most beneficial/educational/entertaining for brewers and non-brewers alike is to brew 6 different styles, so a Pale Ale, a Stout, and 4 undetermined others and then use the infusion method that would best suit that style. I know the most scientific way to do it would be to brew 6 stouts and vary the infusion method between them, but we feel that the differences would be so subtle that they would really be lost on folks that have already been drinking, it would lack meaning for non-brewers since they would be so similar, and after tasting a few it would be real easy to go tongue-blind and have everything blur. We feel varying the styles along with the infusion methods will allow brewers to grasp what that particular infusion method would bring to the table while still being interesting to non-brewers and brewers alike. Give us feedback, we're open to suggestions.
3. We need volunteers
4. We should probably get a list of known infusion methods together and some suggested styles and hash that out between the volunteers.
I'm interested in doing a coffee beer!
Alchemist Eric Franklin did a Rye Pale Ale, and I think he just ran the hot beer over coffee beans before fermenting. It was the most unique coffee beer I've had, and went really well with the style. I'll reach out to him for the recipe.
When I did my Coffee beer, I just soaked whole coffee beans in ethanol for a couple of days and then added them in a muslin bag to the keg.
Cold press is also another method I dabbled in but personally preferred the former.
I think a Blonde needs to be one of the styles. Also possibly a brown ale. Perrin Brewing's (in MI) Kona Brown is perhaps the most intense and awesome coffee beer I've ever had. I'll reach out to them for a recipe or method.
I also know Michael Tonsimiere did a whole NHC presentation on coffee additions. We should look that up and review what he has to say. He consults for Modern Times, did any of the NHC attendees either a) go to his presentation or b) have the MT Black House? I might as well go ahead and reach out to them while I'm at it.
For the Harvest Fest I did the Bender Bending Rodriguez (Coffee Brown Ale). The infusion method I used was pouring in a 32oz bottle of Trader Joes cold brewed, concentrated, pasturized coffee directly into the keg before carbonating. Super easy and works very well. No risk of infection, and no worries of the beer tasting like stale coffee grounds.
If we could figure out a way to have a coffee randel, that would be really cool.
I'd like to try a bean soak in the secondary with a Belgian Blonde. I once had a beer using this method and it was unbelieveable. I'd like to try this process with that style.
My favorite way to do coffee beers is with some cold brew, in a randal, or by "dry hopping" with the beans in secondary. I think cold brew is the best though, as it's very easy to control the amount of coffee and it adds a much smoother coffee flavor with minimal additional acrid or bitterness and you can vary the amount of acidity and brightness by the coffee source I like to use softer varieties with minimal roast characteristics. City roast or lighter, kenyan, ethipia, indonesian varities are all very good for using with coffee beers in my experience, I don't like the more typical dark roasts or sources, sumatra, brazil, columbia, etc, as they add additional acrid notes.
In the boil: Will add additional astringency and bitterness. Best suited for dark roasts as light roast characteristics will be lost.
In primary: Worse than boil, will be over extracted and cause astringency, with very little control over the "degree of coffinees" . Use whole beans
In secondary "dry beaning": Better than boil or primary, finer control over end product. Easier to control level of extraction. Use whole beans, works okay with lighter roasts and dark roasts alike.
Tincture: Soak coffe in an alcohol, add together or strain to your preference. Similar result to boil. Over extraction.
Cold brew: Softer, less acrid notes, smoother flavor profile, less acidity. Works best with light-medium roasts, but still good with dark roasts. My favorite.
FWIW I also dabble in roasting coffee.
I've made a clone of attack of the devil's lettuce from a loose interpretation of the pipeworks recipie. It called for a cold brew added at kegging. It tasted great, I just think I could've added more. BYO just had an article about brewing with coffee that we should look at, as well. I'm very interested in brewing for this, once the timeline comes out and I can see my schedule.
Just trying to condense some of this discussion already. I'd like to pick out some styles first, then tailor the addition of the coffee to that style, as Joe pointed out.
This is just my intiial baseline idea for styles:
1. Blonde
2. Pale
3. Amber
4. Brown
5. Porter
6. Stout
Pros: Mostly comprehensive coverage of a beer spectrum with regard to specialty malt characteristics. These would all be on the "American yeast" side of things to keep that profile more or less neutral, allows brewers to use S-05 and a good pitching rate and reduces variables for comparison.
Cons: Hop clash with Pale/Amber? Porter and Stout very alike.
Other thoughts: A lager? Someone would have to jump on it sooner, but still possible. Traditional Bock, Schwarzbier could be decent options.
Ideas for coffee addition method:
1. Dry beaning (secondary or at kegging)
2. Cold brew
3. Coffee Concentrate (e.g., Trader Joe's)
4. Coffee Extract (I have some and we could potentially score more from Nielsen-Massey)
5. Randall.
6. ??? Coffee Syrup? I buy my Rhode Island native dad a bottle of Autocrat every year for Christmas, but it has sugar and sorbate in it, so may not be a viable option. Could be nostalgic for any homesick New Englanders, though!
Other Cons: Different sources takes away "sponsorship" aspect from a local roaster.
Great discussion - really getting excited about this (and thirsty).
Mike and I talked last night and would like to reserve a volunteer spot for Tuesday Brewsday to brew for the party.
I'd be interested in what happens to these beers on CO2 vs. Nitro. There's a big movement recently of people kegging coldbrew and dispensing with nitrogen, and there are some interesting discussions in that space over the effects of bicarbonate formation on the taste and freshness of the coffee. I would have to think that would be in play here with a coffee beer too, but I haven't seen others talking about it?
http://tinfoilhatbrewery.com/
I think a nitro coffee beer would be a great idea!
That's an awesome suggestion, but may be a little difficult to implement into the actual school series. Definitely worth throwing in the discussion!
We are super excited to say that our neighbors at Dark Matter will be partnering with us for the Stout and Chili Night School series!
It is my thought to aim to have an array of different beer styles that will be dosed with coffee available for this school.
I am currently thinking of having a Blonde, Pale Ale, Amber, Brown, Porter/Stout and to tailor the coffee addition method to the style of beer. I will be working with Dark Matter to see if we are going to stick with one coffee style/blend/whatever or if we are going to play around with that as well.
Feedback and a civilized open discussion are more than welcome to get the ball moving quicker!
Awesome! I'd love to brew the BLONDE with the coffee. Let me know when sign up sheets are available!
Thanks for organizing this Kyle!
Ok, I'm still looking for suggestions and input! I will be meeting with Dark Matter soon (and when I know, I'll post when and where so others may join as well so long as it's not too many of us!) For the most part, if not all, however, the coffee will be added later on in the process, most likely post-fermentation. Therefore, we can start talk about the styles and start brewing them up.
I still want to roll with some (rather) basic base styles to showcase the coffee. I worry about some hop clash, but this should be part of the discussion. I'm leaning toward just using a neutral yeast profile, but am open to suggestions for others (Belgian? Lager?) I am brewing a very basic pale lager this weekend for a "yeast starter" so I could potentially have harvested yeast available for a lager for coffee school.
If you're interested in participating, let's start discussing!
I'd like to add whole beans to my secondary. If I have an option on how to introduce the bean. I want to maintain the golden color while getting the flavor of the coffee. I've experenced a beer like this before at AHA NHC and it was magical. I think it's the best approach for this style.
Cool. Good point about the color!
I'm trying to make it Sunday, but if I can't, someone should ask about coffee additions to BC. I believe they do cold press, but not sure!
I'll try making a coffee lager.
Yup, that sounds right icehouse. You'll nail it. I plan on attending Sunday and will make sure to ask.
What style lager are you thinking?
Mike, can you chime in here for Tuesday Brewsday?
I think Tuesday Brewsday should get the brown ale because:
A) I have brewed some good brown ales recently
B) Brown ales are going to be the style people are least itching to try, so we won't be stepping on any toes.
Ok if anyone hasn't claimed the pale, I'd like to do that! And I'll be "dry beaning" after fermentation if that works for you guys.
@Kyle - I was thinking a Schwarz would be an appropriate style given the relatively short amount of time left until Stout Night.
I have a robust porter that is looking to finish at 1.030 (lots of oats and British pale chocolate). It's 6.6% and tastes surprisingly well balanced considering the final gravity being so high.
Open to coffee addition suggestions, let me know if you think this fits in.
For what it's worth, I'm doing an Imperial stout with smoked coffee beans for Stout Night. I came up with this before the coffee school, so it's something separate. Maybe do a porter instead of a stout for the school to keep a variety of coffee beers?
Yeah, I had lumped Porter and Stout because they basically overlap. I was thinking of wanting to keep gravities below 1.060 anyway.
And don't go stealing our thunder ever again!
Haha! I'll try to hold back.
I am meeting with Brian from Dark Matter tomorrow morning at 7am so if anyone else is free/interested, you're welcome to join.
Sorry for the late notice and early bird time, but both of us have kids to tend to and jobs to do later.
So after doing some digging on the interwebs and such about "dry beaning..." 3-4oz of coursely ground beans in a bag per 5 gallons is the best way to go (in secondary). Start tasting it on day 2-3, but depending on the roast it may take a week to obtain the flavor profile you're looking for.
Word to the wise is to taste it daily apparently. It can go from pleasureable goodness to an ashtray with a quickness. And obviously if you decide not to crush the beans a bit it would take more beans / more time.
Again, this is just for dry beaning. Doing a cold brew would also be a good option.
Looking forward to hearing about your meeting, Kyle!
Yeah, I've found similar stuff, Brandon. I looked extensively at Mike Tonsmiere's blog and he does a quick 24 hours steep (Dry beaning) prior to packaging.
http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2014/08/blonde-ale-on-coffee-beans-...
http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2012/06/toasted-oat-coffee-stout.html
Unless perhaps someone wants a total experiment and to put coffee in the mash, I can't imagine a scenario where the beans/coffee wouldn't be added post-ferm. So this is nice meaning that we can get to brewing the beers! These are all the questions I'll be asking Brian and his team, though!
So we started a great conversation that still has some things to cover within the next week or so. Needless to say, the guys at Dark Matter are incredibly amped up about this project, and forging a relationship in general. We may have opened up a (good!) bag of worms with them as there's things they want to cover that are out of the scope of Coffee School at Stout and Chili night.
Our plan remains the same: we'll brew a variety of beers and they'll supply the coffee. It will likely come from Guatemala or Ecuador and be single origin. We'll get more than we need, I assure you - and I hope to have it at the brewhouse to pick up hopefully in about two weeks and definitely before close of 2015. However, we still feel post-fermentation additions will be best, so most additions will be added sometime in January.
They are going to talk more among the beer-centric people there (who do the collaboration work for FFF and Half Acre) to determine some methodologies to put into place. Unfortunately, two members of this team are currently in Guatemala (but come back stateside tomorrow) so they were unable to be there this morning. But I'll counter that with saying that a Randall may be in place at SCN! And conversely from that, they said they rarely like to Cold Brew with a beer. The method they employ for Chocolate City wouldn't be feasible for us homebrewers unless someone has a nitrogren flushing source, and takes away from having a single coffee source across the board. Sorry, cold-press fans.
So let's get these beers brewed - it looks like we're still looking to fill two spots, and I'm still open to discussion about styles other than the ones I have listed if those aren't interesting. I can always fill one void, but am leaving this open to the rest of the club for the time being to garner more interest other than just myself.
I'll take the Porte/stout and get it brewed next week! I'm been following this thread like a creepy lurker peaking into chaos and feel it's finally time to knock on the door and ask if I can come it.
Damn right there will be a coffee Randall onsite for the party, but it won't be part of the coffee school.
Haha!!
Looks like one slot left for the Amber - any takers?!
If not, I'd be happy to do it, I shouldn't have an issue brewing sometime over the holiday break.
I'll keep it open for any other takers until the end of the week.
Also, I never made it clear, but obviously no set recipes here. I trust y'all enough to brew something to the style you've selected. If you have any questions or need advice, post away, we're all here to help.
I would try to keep a neutralish yeast (S-05 is always a good choice for neutral and keeping things the same) and the gravity below 1.060.
Hey Kyle. I'm brewing a Russian imperial stout tomorrow using a recipe I've been wanting to try for awhile. It's calls for cold press coffee addition but I'll stick with the bean hopping for sure. London Ale yeast and the starter is already ... started. Just wanted to make sure it'd be ok
I've blocked out time for Sunday 12/20 to brew my Belgain Blonde, using the recipe from Brewing Classic Styles. Curious if we have a date as to when we'll get the beans from Dark Matter? I'd like to plan ahead and work that process into my schedule. Do we have a date set for when the beans will be provided to us? Please let me know.
Thanks, Nanc
@John - RIS is going to be well above 1.060. I'd like to keep the gravity down.
@Nanc - Belgian doesn't seem like neutral yeast! Any way you could do a split batch?
But I guess beggars can't be choosers if it's this late in the game.
Beans should be availble by the end of the year, but they shouldn't be added until about 24-48 before packaging.
I can do a regular Blonde if you think the Belgian yeast will fight with the coffee flavors.
Yeah, I hate to take it away from your plan, though. You said you had a commerical example that was solid, so I'm inclined to let it roll.
I have my starter made and grains bought. Sorry, I didn't see any stipulations. I promise I'll consult and scale up the coffee amount to make sure we can taste it
That actually gives me an idea! I'll get with you privately to discuss :)
Fuck yeah on the Randall. Great job coordinating this, Kyle. I'll take the amber if no one else has.
Oh, sorry - Jeff reached out to me today to claim the Amber - I should have put it down! He did say tentatively, though, so it might still be available. I'll keep everyone posted.
Coffee will be ready Monday! I will hopefully have it at the brewhouse sometime later that week. It will be a single origin Guatemalan bean from San Jeronimo Miramar hybrid between Catimor and Catuaii. I don't know what a lot of that means (reading now), but super excited. They are harvesting it and roasting it JUST FOR CHAOS. Read that last sentence again - Dark Matter has not only gone to bat for us, but they've just belted a Grand Slam. Give them your business when you can!
Each brewer will have plenty of coffee to experiment with and most likley be able to drink a couple of regular cups as well.
I also plan to save some to brew that night on a rotating basis, perhaps. Does anyone have a Chemex or Aeropress they'd be willing to loan and/or operate? I understand the fragile nature of the things, so completely understandable if you're not down. I have a FP which I'll bring and despite my original thoughts in not having cold press, I think it does us a disservice to leave it out since a wide variety of brewers do employ this method, so I'll brew some regular coffee cold press as well for SCN.
I have a 3 liter pump thermos caraffee type thing if you want prebrew a bunch of it and have it in the thermos for tasting. It is stainless steel double walled vacuum sealed so either hot or cold it should stay at prefered temp most of the night.
That is great Kyle!
Mike and I brewed a 10 gallon batch for Tuesday Brewsday, so 5 gallons will go on at the party, and I think we could spare some bombers to give back as well.
Okay, my Adambier is okay, so I can pass on the amber. It's all yours, Matt! Get.It.
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