We've planned to do some renovations in the ferm room during the weekend of July 7 through July 9.
Here's what is planned:
- Remove the entire floor, then replace it with a covering (TBD) over the cement surface.
- Remove the doorway lip.
- Add additional shelving.
- We also plan to do some various organizing projects around the brew house, including the club storage spot in the middle of upstairs.
This will require us to remove all of the carboys in the ferm room on the evening of July 7th then return them on the evening of July 9th. Please plan your brewing around this schedule. As long as your beer is not undergoing primary fermentation, it'll be fine outside the ferm room for the weekend. This may also be a great time to brew a saison or some other warm fermenting beer.
The Sunday meetings will proceed as scheduled.
Also, any carboys/kegs that do not have a label will be taken out of circulation, so please make sure your beer is squared away.
This will all go much quicker with a lot of help. We obviously can't fit a ton of people in the ferm room at once. However we will need a lot of people for removing, then returning the carboys/kegs, plus helping with the other projects.
Those of you who are new(er), this type of projects are how we got the brew house to it's current state, so please try to find some time to stop by and help out.
Those of you looking for alchemist status, helping out or taking the lead on a project like this will go a long way towards your free storage spot and +1 for parties.
If you would like to take the lead and/or help with the actual demo and new floor/shelving installation, please respond below.
Do we need a large sledgehammer? I can procure one.
I have a feeling it will come in handy...
I hear Chuck has a sledgehammer that cost him $5.99 he can lend us.
I still have the wheel barrel we used for project fuckrats. If you guys want to use that I can drop it off before that weekend. I'll check my schedule if I'm free to help out with the actual project too
We plan to remove the raised flooring, so need something cleanable and seemless to cover the concrete. Any recommendations?
Steve, thanks, the wheel barrel will come in handy during the tear down.
x3 we'll be all set.
I would just paint/seal the concrete. garage floor paint something like that. Make cleaning it easy
I second just sealing the concrete. They make a paint/sealant that is texured for garage flooring that woud be ideal.
Sealing concrete, that sounds good. Glass carboys on cement? That sounds like disaster.
Can we get some type of rubber mats? Something like this or this? (Not those specifically.)
Agreed, we can't have glass carboy to concrete contact. If we go the mat route, they'll have to be smooth, rather than grooved, for easy cleaning.
raised rubber mats like they have outside of showers in gyms and stuff. will allow water to pass through and keep the carboys on soft surfaces
Maybe something like one of these three options?
Elephant Bark
Terra-Flex
Recycled Rubber
Rubber drainage mats
http://www.americanfloormats.com/rubber-drainage-mats/
The emperor is not as forgiving as i am
Let's get volunteer list going, so we have a general idea of how much person power we'll have next weekend. Just comment below with the day and general time frame you'll be able to pitch in.
I'm available to help.
We should seal the floor and use mats. Beer is going to leak through whatever we lay down, might as well make it easier to clean down the road.
Drainage mats are disgusting over time. If the ferm room had a drain, it would make sense to let beer flow through, but letting beer congeal in all those nooks and cranies is gonna make a puke inducing mess. Unless we clean it out 2-3 times a year.
Rubber flooring could be cool, gives us the opportunity to create a cove like wall border, but the seams will just let beer leek through and rot.
Spill containment trays along the edges of the room would be cheaper, and when a spill happens, you can just take one tray to the sink and clean it.
http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/material-handling/drum-barrel/spill-co...
I'll look at the square footage and price out options tonight.
The following image shows how each of the suggested floor/shelf coverings price out, as well as estimating how many fermentors each option holds.
Containment Trays: $414.00 (54 carboys)
Pros: Modular, work on shelves, easy to clean
Cons: Limited capacity, could crack
Drainage Mats: $480.00 (48 carboys/buckets)
Pros: Fit more containers, less likely to crack or tear
Cons: Filth collectors, stinky
Recycled Rubber Mats: $220.00 (57 carboys/buckets)
Pros: Affordable, can be cut to fit
Cons: We will shred these to pieces
The shelves will not allow us to line the room wall to wall with rubber mats. The feet of the big shelves will die cut the rubber mat, even smaller shelves will tear up the mats. I suspect heavy buckets will have a cookie cutter like effect as well.
These are very expensive band-aids that will need to be replaced. Sealing the floors will help clean up down the line. FWIW, I brewed 10 years in basements with concrete floors, and the only way I've busted a glass carboy is through cold shock and falling off a fountain.
Thanks for putting this together!! It looks like the containment trays would be the way to go. Not the least expensive, but the most practical. Are you thinking we should still seal the floor?
How easy would it be to cut the containment trays around the existing shelving, or will the existing shelving need to be replaced as well?
Unless we do a seamless full floor cover, it makes sense to me to seal the floor with the expectation we are moving mats and mopping more often. If you think about it, having a few carboys on a smaller mat makes it easier to clean up an isolated spill (same principal behind sectional carpeting.)
Cutting a containment tray would compromise its structural integrity. Also, I'm not sure 3 fermenters would fit in the tray if 14" buckets are in the mix, and I suspect there is a good chance the trays would crack. Maybe we could buy a couple to test out?
The 2x3 drainage mats have some issues too, they will not just neatly fit between the legs of shelves, so cuts will be needed and we'll wind up with ragged seams.
Here's another look at four options (pic below), I'm starting to think cutting pieces of rubber and mounting them to a thin board base is the way to go. However, that's another issue with rubber rolls, we need to mount them to a substrate. The terra flex roll is more expensive, but it is much tougher.
Fuck, why did it take so long to think rubber runner!?!
Cheap, rugged, easy to cut, lays flat, yellow stripe is kinda badass (pic below).
This is the way to go:
http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/foodservice/mats-carpets/anti-fatigue/...
The rubber runner could work well! If we have a mess, we can just remove that sheet, hose it off, then return it to the ferm room. Plus, it's 1/4 the price of our other options.
We will need to apply new baseboards. It would be cool to have some sort of cove tile treatment (pic below).
I was thinking a big bead of super tough caulk or epoxy could create the radius corner treatment to keep beer from flowing under the walls. Maybe tar?
We need 50 feet of baseboard (4-6 inches high). It was discussed that we would cut the floor out. We need to make the baseboard area as flush to the floor as possible, and we'll probably need taller baseboards to cover the gap left by the floor being removed.
Will the baseboard be the same material as the flooring? I'm not sure what would be best to keep the beer out, but I think caulk could work fine.
If we take the floor out and go down to the concrete, a baseboard with caulk would be the only way to make a sealed perimeter. Slathering tar along the floor and wall could also work (like roofing), but tar is gross and needs to be redone. I did waterproofing in basements one summer, those guys go to epoxy when all else fails.
We currently have a base strip (pic below), but it wasn't really sealed, or shifting materials broke the seal. This seems like the trickiest part, we might want to assess materials after ripping the floor out. Home Depot has tons of base board options.
Look for Anti Slip Concrete Epoxy ( like https://goo.gl/q84gEB )
Can we get Omura to put out a call for volunteers? At the very least we will need a ton of people to move beer on the first day.
I will be able to help. Probably all 3 days.
Sorry guys I'm always down to help but I'm totally booked that weekend. I'll drop off the wheel barrel and remove my fermenter from there Thursday
I can be there for parts of it. I'll plan on being there Friday night for carboy moving for sure.
www.singingboysbrewing.com
Steven, how about we order the rubber mats, since they seem to be the best option.
I like the idea of removing the floor, then seeing what it looks like with the mats before deciding on baseboards or caulk/epoxy.
I will be there definitely Friday to help move fermentors (might actually be there early afternoon and can start early and get to knocking it out and possibly even demoing the floor Fri night).
Maybe sometime Saturday but up in the air.
Will be there Sunday an hour or two before the meeting, maybe sooner.
We should rip part of the floor out Friday night so we know what we're looking at. Cleaning and sealing the floor needs to be done ASAP. If we intend to load the room up Sunday, we need to pick a floor sealant that will cure in 24 hours (most recommendations say 48 hours.)
Jeff, go ahead and order the mats (14 mats). I haven't seen anyplace that come close to matching $9.50 for a 2x3 foot mat.
http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/foodservice/mats-carpets/anti-fatigue/...
Reed's got 2 sledges, I'm assuming we'll need a circular saw to cut through the 2x4s too. Does anyone know if the floor 2x4s are attached to the wall framing?
The room floats on the floor for the most part. Screws were run through boards sinking into the concrete, but a few of those screws didn't take well.
This is not a sledgehammer demo. We have to cut the floor and pull it up without knocking the perimeter off its line. Saws and pry bars are needed.
I'll bring some saws....a small battery powered circular saw (can cut through a 2x4), 2 or 3 sawzalls, and chop saw with a stand. I'll see if I can find my prybars too.
We should schedule a garbage pick up for Thursday, July 6th, so we have dumpster room for the old floor
Thanks Reed, your cordless circular saw will be super handy. It's going to be tough avoiding screws, but we do not have many floor "joists" to take out. Hopefully we can keep the base of the wall smooth and even so we can apply a sealed baseboard perimeter.
If anyone wants some hammer-time, I have a couple of big granite blocks that need to be broken down into stein-sized pieces for the firepit. A chisel and sledge should do.
Since I don't have access to the club card, I asked Ben and/or Mark to order the rubber mats.
I can probabl be there Friday afternoon and definitely on Sunday before the meetings.
I'll be by Friday night to help. You guys need to watch more TV, we could bust this out in 10 minutes with 3-4 spray cans of FlexSeal.
Steven - If you recall, I shot anchors into the floor, so those will have to be dealt with if you are removing the wall plate.
Rich, my memory is kinda fuzzy, but I do recall the sound of gun shots and being scared :-O
I don't have a TV, thank gawd for YouTube:
"I gotta say, I'm a little disappointed in FlexSeal" (dude on his roof)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvldjXH6cPo
Regardless of sealant, 24 hr cure minimum.
I should be able to help friday around 8:30/9 till late/early>
cheers
Stephen - That's just, like, his opinion, man. The dude made a boat with it!
Are you guys good on tools and stuff then?
I can be there pretty much all of Sunday for finishing/reloading of carboys (or whatever).
FWIW I love Steven's Black/yellow mat idea if its possible to make it work - cheaper, seamless AND badass.
Sorry, I got my weekends confused. I'm at the Brewer's Cup in Indianapolis this Friday - Sunday, so am not available. Typical . . .
www.singingboysbrewing.com
I can come help with moving the carboys on Friday, what time are we starting?
I dropped off a chop saw and stand and a black duffle bag of sawzalls on the shelf above the barrels. I have the batteries charging at my apt and will bring them and the small circular over in the next day or so.
Also in the end of the duffle are a handful of prybars, and there is a pressure washer in club storage upstairs if you want to blast the floor before painting
Reed's the go-to guy to break into some shit.
Ken - I'll be starting Friday as soon as I can get there - 4:30 at the latest, I'd bet, but I'll probably clock all my hours before then and realistically be there closer to 3:30.
I also plan to get there around 3:00-3:30 on Friday.
Will not be able to make it tomorrow, sorry. Thought this was going to be last Friday(I even showed up). Will come by on Saturday to help finish up anything, though.
Pages